Whats the best way to move up in IT field?

From: Jonathan Burishkin 
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What do you consider the best way to move up in the IT field?

I am working is an IT Support Specialist, basically Help Desk type of work,
but I do a bit more then that. Ive professionally worked in this field only
about 2 or so years, although I have lots of experience experimenting and
messing around with computers for many years (15 or so?).

Ive herd through a few people that have good IT jobs
that Certifications and experience is the way to go and they mainly look
for experience.

Through Certifications?
Through Associates Degree?
Through Bachelors Degree?
Through Experience alone?
Other ways?

-- 
Jonathan Burishkin
706.876.8414

=============================================================== From: Randy Yates ------------------------------------------------------ All the above... The basic premise is to keep learning. Don't focus on moving up. Focus about learning. Spend all your free time learning new skills.

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Find a new position with a new company.... it's almost your only option. Unless you can better describe experimenting and messing around, then you only have a couple of years of experience. Get some more of that too. When you're on the "desk", you need to be working on some other certs, otherwise, all you have is X number of years "on the desk". Your current employer is unlikely to have an IT apprenticeship to help move your career along, so it's up to you to prove to your next interview that you know something besides the "desk". Gets past HR screens... No value that I am aware of... Gets past HR screens... Great, if you can get in front of the right person who can validate it... Still looking and open to suggestions... Regards, dtb - -- "Some things in life can never be fully appreciated nor understood unless experienced firsthand. Some things in networking can never be fully understood by someone who neither builds commercial networking equipment nor runs an operational network." RFC 1925 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://www.enigmail.net/ iEYEARECAAYFAlBtvtcACgkQABP1RO+tr2Ta8QCcCvSw2wQojGAv0G4+FB5IpFd+ QX4An3kweN+n6s5SHfuh2jSw/RzhahIk =9Ud7 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Ed King ------------------------------------------------------ From: Jonathan Burishkin marry the boss' daughter

=============================================================== From: Tim Youngblood ------------------------------------------------------ Improve your communication skills. Is your knowledge accessible so others can work with you and benefit from it? All the certs in the world won't help you if you cannot confer and receive knowledge from your fellow humans.

=============================================================== From: Ed King ------------------------------------------------------ unlike other tech folks who have the "if I'm the only person who knows how to do x, then that's job security" mentality, I document the living shit out of everything I do. I've heard that one way to move "up" in a company is to train someone to do your job. I've yet to see that actually happen, probably because I'm right under the COO on the org chart, lol.

=============================================================== From: Eric Wolf ------------------------------------------------------ 1. More often than not, the only way to move up is to move on. Does the company you work for actually have positions for you to move into? Like Ed's case, there may be no up without going elsewhere. 2. Does the company you work for value you too highly in your current position? Do they hire outside people in above you? You may be doing too good of a job at the things in your job description but not a good enough job at the other things. Practice your golf swing. Go to the boss's church (in the Southeast). 3. More importantly, do you actually want to move up? Google and Microsoft are filled with miserable project managers: competent engineers who moved up but loathed the new position. And up doesn't necessarily mean more pay. 4. Create your own position by doing a project on your own. Either at work or at home. I make 25%-40% of my income doing contract work outside my regular position. A final word of advice: getting a PhD is probably the stupidest thing anyone in IT could possibly do! -Eric -=--=---=----=----=---=--=-=--=---=----=---=--=-=- Eric B. Wolf 720-334-7734

=============================================================== From: Mike Harrison ------------------------------------------------------ Dead On. ------------- A sucky brogrammer with poor chops but great communications skills and a sharp appearance will usually get promoted over the gnarly quiet uber geek that spews magic (quietly). http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=brogrammer http://ciappara.com/2012/05/16/are-you-a-brogrammer-or-a-programmer/ Not sure what the network admin / sysadmin equivelent is but I am sure it's out there.

=============================================================== From: John Aldrich ------------------------------------------------------ Quoting Tim Youngblood : No, but the PHBs only seem to care about certs. They don't care if you can't admin your way out of a paper bag, they just want to see that shiny cert. Now, this is NOT true of "clueful" bosses, but most "clueful" bosses probably won't be working for a big company, or there will be so many "gatekeepers" between you and them that they will never even SEE your resume unless you have certs. Now that's just my impression. Of course, if you know someone who knows someone on the inside, all bets are off. :D

=============================================================== From: Eric Wolf ------------------------------------------------------ The sys admin equivalent is the "Systems Architect"... Maybe the spectrum extends from "BOFH" at the low end to "Archi-Dude in the Cloud(s)". In the Federal Government, one's ability to position oneself in the right project and take credit at the right time determines one's promotion capacity. And if you get the right promotion at the right time, you may land a fast track series of promotions once people start realizing that you are totally incompetent and the only way to get rid of you is to promote you away. -Eric -=--=---=----=----=---=--=-=--=---=----=---=--=-=- Eric B. Wolf 720-334-7734

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Having held an "architect" title, I just may be insulted by that. Of course, those were the days before everyone was jumping up and down on vague vaporous masses floating around somewhere in the stratosphere, and I usually see these referencing programmers or project managers, not actual network designers and such as the work I performed in this role.... Ahh, the old fuck-up move-up management plan. I haven't seen that since I left Compaq.... Regards, dtb - -- "Some things in life can never be fully appreciated nor understood unless experienced firsthand. Some things in networking can never be fully understood by someone who neither builds commercial networking equipment nor runs an operational network." RFC 1925 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://www.enigmail.net/ iEYEARECAAYFAlBt5nsACgkQABP1RO+tr2RmNwCgnIK7sdNSHRwO4AsFji/bI/ut SBcAnj2Qirr4ykj7jr05/l8YF7OpNfdC =4kHb -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Eric Wolf ------------------------------------------------------ I was "Web Architect" at BCBST for a stint around 99 and then "E-Commerce Architect" at Q-Debit until the bubble burst. My job at BCBST was primarily to attend meetings as the token geek and explain what parts of the latest sales pitch wouldn't work (BS) and how we could do something cheaper and easier in-house. Most of the time I was ignored. I left before too many of these half-baked technologies became my responsibility. At Q-Debit, my job was mainly trying to work out how to get clients' systems talking to ours and making sure we didn't send too much money to the wrong accounts. Unfortunately, I was never smart enough to make sure the "wrong account" happened to be my own. ;) -Eric

=============================================================== From: William Wade ------------------------------------------------------ Don't know if anyone has mentioned it yet, but I'll suggest two ways that are less common (and not for everyone). 1. GitHub. Make code/docs/scripts/etc... Publish it. Repeat. 2. Join a startup.

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Expanding on 1, that's not exactly my cup of tea (might be yours!), but joining a SIG/LUG (which you have, because you are here) and participating (which you have because you posted) might accomplish the same thing on a smaller scale (which may be your target audience anyway). Don't be afraid to ask questions, and don't be afraid to attempt to help. Some of us on bad days on low caffeine might do a better or more thorough job, but the person who asked will remember you tried, especially if you put them on the right track and they figure it out themselves. As to 2, there's quite a bit riding on that decision, I would recommend only doing so if you find one that you are truly passionate about, and you can ride the economics. Regards, dtb - -- "Some things in life can never be fully appreciated nor understood unless experienced firsthand. Some things in networking can never be fully understood by someone who neither builds commercial networking equipment nor runs an operational network." RFC 1925 -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://www.enigmail.net/ iEYEARECAAYFAlBt9pAACgkQABP1RO+tr2SyngCghVu7W6gSTH0VLoQgaEx2N1Ur tycAn1IHNyqcG23WaeTqX+0fqrR7Bv/V =PUZ4 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: David Snyder ------------------------------------------------------ How to move up? Here is my perspective as an employer and small business = owner. 1. Realize that it isn't about you, it is about your company or orga= nization. You are employed to serve the company, the company isn't there t= o serve you. 2. Demonstrate this through your work ethic. a. Never be late. b. Always go the "extra mile". c. Don't ever say "It's not my job". 3. Show initiative. I can't tell you how many times I've told my emp= loyees when they ask me a technical question. "I don't know the answer, Le= t me Google it for a while and I'll get back with you". If I'm feeling fru= strated at the time I may say "You know, you have the fastest Internet conn= ection in the area, and the world's greatest research tool in the history o= f man at your desk. Why don't you look for the answer, and, after you find= it, ask me if what you found is the right solution"? 4. Constantly upgrade your skills. You will be more useful to your c= ompany when you know and are competent in more skills. This will require t= hat you sacrifice some of your personal time for study and experimentation.= Skip some games and TV shows and improve your skills. If you like what = your company does, figure out the skills they use and need and learn those = skills. 5. If you do these things your worth to the company will become evide= nt. They will either give you a raise or you will move on to a company tha= t appreciates your skills. 6. Memorize point 1. It is really important. If you don't get that = you will never advance. From: chugalug-bounces@chugalug.org [mailto:chugalug-bounces@chugalug.org] = On Behalf Of Jonathan Burishkin Sent: Thursday, October 04, 2012 12:40 PM To: chugalug@chugalug.org Subject: [Chugalug] Whats the best way to move up in IT field? What do you consider the best way to move up in the IT field? I am working is an IT Support Specialist, basically Help Desk type of work,= but I do a bit more then that. Ive professionally worked in this field onl= y about 2 or so years, although I have lots of experience experimenting and= messing around with computers for many years (15 or so?). Ive herd through a few people that have good IT jobs that Certifications an= d experience is the way to go and they mainly look for experience. Through Certifications? Through Associates Degree? Through Bachelors Degree? Through Experience alone? Other ways? -- Jonathan Burishkin 706.876.8414

=============================================================== From: John Aldrich ------------------------------------------------------ Quoting David Snyder : [snip] [snip[ I have to say, that's one of the things I was privileged to learn from my short tenure at VolState. Thanks for teaching me that, David!

=============================================================== From: Gary Hasty ------------------------------------------------------ Of course, IMHO, as someone that's been in IT for the last 25 years but = only in "IT" for 2 of those years is GET THE HELL OUT OF IT. Get into the lines of business and understand what makes the company = tick. I see many CIOs now being replaced by various lines of business = exes (especially CMOs) business owner. or organization. You are employed to serve the company, the company = isn=92t there to serve you. told my employees when they ask me a technical question. =93I don=92t = know the answer, Let me Google it for a while and I=92ll get back with = you=94. If I=92m feeling frustrated at the time I may say =93You know, = you have the fastest Internet connection in the area, and the world=92s = greatest research tool in the history of man at your desk. Why don=92t = you look for the answer, and, after you find it, ask me if what you = found is the right solution=94? your company when you know and are competent in more skills. This will = require that you sacrifice some of your personal time for study and = experimentation. Skip some games and TV shows and improve your skills. = If you like what your company does, figure out the skills they use and = need and learn those skills. evident. They will either give you a raise or you will move on to a = company that appreciates your skills. get that you will never advance. [mailto:chugalug-bounces@chugalug.org] On Behalf Of Jonathan Burishkin work, but I do a bit more then that. Ive professionally worked in this = field only about 2 or so years, although I have lots of experience = experimenting and messing around with computers for many years (15 or = so?). Certifications and experience is the way to go and they mainly look for = experience.

=============================================================== From: Jonathan Burishkin ------------------------------------------------------ The company I work for is going to pay for training. Probably an Associates Degree. I will be taking this degree: http://catalog.daltonstate.edu/associatedegree/compnetworkservicetech/ A little rant about my job: My co worker always complains about everything and sometimes tryes not to do the work the IT manager gives him. He screws up things often and I have to solve problems for him. Its kind-of annoying, but I think the IT Director and IT Manager and Networking guy are starting to realize how he is. Of course the Networking guy does not take credit for anything unless its good even-though its obviously his fault and if something is not working right and I tell him its the switch or something like that he usually does not want to believe me, but I have been correct in every instance as he is not very thorough. A little glorification about my job: It is very laid back. We are not micromanaged at all. Sometimes I have too much free time and other times we are swamped so it makes it nice. I have time to do my own 3D piddling in Blender. I have room to use Linux in certain areas as the Network guy and IT manager and server guy are Windows only guys, but they are willing to let me do my Linux thing. I live close enough to go home for my hour lunch break. The IT Director does a good job. -- Jonathan Burishkin 706.876.8414