Email clients

From: Dan Lyke 
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Claws-Mail is ticking me off. Undo in the message editor has been
b0rk3n for years, and there are enough other quirks and strange lockups
that I'm looking for alternatives.

Charlene has gotten to the "hate" level for Evolution.

I thought "Xubuntu defaults to Thunderbird, let's look at that!".
Thunderbird lacks piping to external apps in its filtering, which means
that I can't do basic things like "add everything this client sends me
to a folder and commit it to a git repo".

And Thunderbird also lacks a lot of basic polish. Their RSS client is
abominable (though I could probably get along with it now that I've
figured out its quirks), but there's a lot of stuff that seems like
programmers implemented that way because of underlying architecture
brokenness rather than user need: Why is the common operation 5 clicks
and the uncommon operation 2?

I'd hate to go back to Fetchmail, Perl scripts and Pine, but is that
really the best email situation for GUI linux these days?

Dan



=============================================================== From: William Wade ------------------------------------------------------ I work on so many different boxes that I just use web clients these days.

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Evolution is right there with LookOut! in my book... I moved to Tbird from Eudora, lots of things to like, lots of things not to like. Your specific example is number 3 on my list of why I run my own mail server. Specifically, Sieve and procmail for auto-sorting, and auto-doing something with my email as it arrives. Client side filtering alone just plain sucks (at least in my experience), lots of little gotchas trying to configure them. I found Sieve much easier and reliable to deal with. I had great hopes for the Eudora/Tbird switch-over that was supposed to be coming, but I haven't heard anything about it, except for running a specific version of (unpatched, old) Tbird with specific scripts/add-ons to make the "Eudora Build". No thanks. If you want to do everything client-side.... unfortunately, I believe it is... Regards, dtb -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk7KsjYACgkQABP1RO+tr2SM8gCeLUewfPfB/1disFkBDFD5cSfa EuoAn0jr4CtwQTkPkh/ZHThzWC8xhTVv =ZYa5 -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Cameron Kilgore ------------------------------------------------------ I just use web clients when I can't use Sparrow on my Mac. Sparrow is really paired down, and that's what I like in my email clients. --Cameron

=============================================================== From: Dave Brockman ------------------------------------------------------ -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Which are even more restricted on what we can do with them compared to a traditional fat email client. I don't think viewing in a web browser solves any of Dan's problems. Regards, dtb -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2.0.17 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAk7KtQkACgkQABP1RO+tr2R08QCgiIMlf19RyQNif4XH+Fya913/ bxsAn3iNA1ffYvsNNrc8wXplUzk+2FIR =8oPr -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

=============================================================== From: Rod-Lists ------------------------------------------------------ which version of thunderbird are you using? Heard there was a new one that added a lot of features. opera still broken on your distro? I realy like that mail client. My next desktop will probably use it for mail. I been looking into both zimbra and horde for a project or two but that may be more than you want to mess with. New horde has cleaned up a lot since I last looked at it. ----- Original Message ----- From: Dan Lyke To: CHUGALUG Sent: Mon, 21 Nov 2011 15:00:01 -0500 (EST) Subject: [Chugalug] Email clients Claws-Mail is ticking me off. Undo in the message editor has been b0rk3n for years, and there are enough other quirks and strange lockups that I'm looking for alternatives. Charlene has gotten to the "hate" level for Evolution. I thought "Xubuntu defaults to Thunderbird, let's look at that!". Thunderbird lacks piping to external apps in its filtering, which means that I can't do basic things like "add everything this client sends me to a folder and commit it to a git repo". And Thunderbird also lacks a lot of basic polish. Their RSS client is abominable (though I could probably get along with it now that I've figured out its quirks), but there's a lot of stuff that seems like programmers implemented that way because of underlying architecture brokenness rather than user need: Why is the common operation 5 clicks and the uncommon operation 2? I'd hate to go back to Fetchmail, Perl scripts and Pine, but is that really the best email situation for GUI linux these days? Dan

=============================================================== From: Rod-Lists ------------------------------------------------------ Zimbra seems to still have a desktop client that can access other mail accounts. http://www.zimbra.com/products/desktop

=============================================================== From: John Aldrich ------------------------------------------------------ Quoting Dan Lyke : Have you looked at KMail? I haven't tried KMail2 yet, but the "old" =20 KMail had a LOT of filtering it would do built-in. Might work for you.

=============================================================== From: Dan Lyke ------------------------------------------------------ On Mon, 21 Nov 2011 15:47:05 -0500 (EST) Rod-Lists wrote: 7.0.1. Whatever the features, the RSS handling, where you add a folder, then you can add one or more feeds to a folder, but only in the funky editor which doesn't sort the folders by anything meaningful and doesn't help you when you've accidentally attached a feed to a folder that had nothing to do with the folder in question and are now trying to recover from the problem, is totally messed up. And the error handling for RSS it doesn't like is totally sub-optimal. Further, I can't figure out how to import my ~/Mail folder, which is kind of a basic function. I could probably get by the lack of piping on filtering by setting up folders and running a cron job to look for new mail in those folders. Maybe, if they did it right. I used to use Opera, and there was a lot I really liked about it, but it was a closed ecosystem. The "I'm not going back" moment was when I was migrating away from it and started to export my mail, and realized I was going to have to right-click and export on 70 or 80 folders to make the process work. It didn't, at the time, have a "pipe to external app" option, and I don't see one now. It looks like the Zimbra solution is a "fetchmail to procmail to ..." thing. Maybe I'll just suck it up and do this with Thunderbird. Although Kontact/KMail seems to have the features I want. Anyone have thoughts on the stability of those?

=============================================================== From: Dee Holtsclaw ------------------------------------------------------ That's what I've been using in Ubuntu but the Akondai stuff always crashes the first time I fire it up.

=============================================================== From: Mike Harrison ------------------------------------------------------ I'm replying in Pine, because for large volumes of e-mail, it's really really hard to beat. Fast, efficient. clean and virus/expoit resistant (if not proof). I use Evolution pointed to gmail/IMAP at work, and I hate it. It does work better for dealing with MS-idiots and Goo-idiots better, although I still often pipe things through "tnef" to extract crap from "winmail.dat" files. Every layer of abstraction that loads onto e-mail, seems to make it less appropriate to use by intelligent people. --Mike--

=============================================================== From: Adam Jimerson ------------------------------------------------------ Because Pine is dead most recent distros should ship with Alpine (Alternative Licensed Pine), which is the Pine replacement. I play with it at home and has proven useful in places with bad/terrible internet connection, and would recommend giving it a try. It is sad that most GUI email clients for any OS pretty much sucks. I guess developers spend to much time on "shiny" than making it work correctly. I have always hated Evolution, its to clunky and does some weird things, I noticed that Evolution would take considerably longer to open an email than other clients such as Kmail (which has its own issues), and Thunderbird.

=============================================================== From: Billy ------------------------------------------------------ Dan, Aren't there thunderbird plugins that can pipe data to external programs? I know that some of the gpg encryption plugins used to do that, so in theory= someone should have made a plugin to do it generically. It's a common probl= em I'm sure... One that a geek has already solved. Sent from my iPhone