html5 canvas, issues with svg, and is it too early for CSS3?

From: "K. Elise Walker" 
Has anyone had a chance to play around with the canvas tag yet? If so, what
did you like or dislike about it? I'm just starting to play around with it
and wondering if anyone has opinions on it yet?

also, is it too early to play around with css3 on the new version of my
site? I'm probably switching to a css image gallery instead of the
javascript slideshow just for flashiness sake. but I don't want to break
potential customer's browsers with code they can't display so I tend to dumb
it down a bit so they can still view it properly. Should I throw caution to
the wind this time and jump right on in or stay cautious?

and finally, does anyone know of a work around to get IE 8 to display .svg
graphics? trying to get the 9-5 to start using .svg and .png which I've been
suggesting for over 5 years.. they've finally agreed but only if there is a
workaround to get IE 8 to display the .svgs - I've heard of such a thing but
haven't had time to research it properly. any suggestions?? I heard at one
time there was a Renesis plugin available for IE8, but I dont know if this
is a safe or valid option at this point. I heard that IE9 had limited
support for svg, and hopefully 10 may have full support. I just don't know
enough about the browser, because I'm snobby and refuse to use it at home.
any help would be appreciated.

Thank you for the opportunity to work with you. I look forward to your

K. Elise Walker
Design and Development Specialist
Werkew Design | 1-423-622-4243

=============================================================== From: Troy Melhase ------------------------------------------------------ The HTML5 canvas tag is pretty cool, but the thing to keep in mind is that it's a pretty low level interface (if there could be such a thing for web client programming). You'll end up writing a lot of drawing code if you use it. When it comes to CSS3, support is pretty good across the board. You might have to use some vendor tags, and as long as you stay away from the really fancy stuff, it will look the same on every browser. Don't expect IE to do the right thing and you won't be disappointed. Don't bother with SVG in IE, there's a much, much better way: It uses SVG when available, and VML when it's not (again, IE sucks, but at least the raphaeljs library will hide the suckage from you). troy

=============================================================== From: Ryan Bales ------------------------------------------------------ If you want to avoid a ton of drawing code, check out paper.js or Raphael ~Ryan Bales

=============================================================== From: Dan Lyke ------------------------------------------------------ On Tue, 19 Jul 2011 05:33:18 -0400 "K. Elise Walker" wrote: I've been using it a bit for JavaScript created stuff. I like that I can do all sorts of transforms and clipping regions and stuff on the client. For the particular application I'm using it for, everyone's happy to say "Oh, doesn't work on IE8? Too bad for them." (I love when technical people run artistic companies...) Speaking of which: I've got a little Perl lying around that appears to do an okay job of converting the basic SVG regions to JavaScript canvas calls. I'm using it to lay out clipping regions as SVG curves. You're welcome to it, if you'd like. And the one weird thing I'm still having trouble getting used to: Apparently, the canvas allocates a bitmap and you're simply writing into it. It took me a moment to reorient my thinking back to the pre-event-driven redraws days, back in the '80s when... [Dan rambles off into senility...]. Dan

=============================================================== From: Cameron Kilgore ------------------------------------------------------ I've been leery of Canvas because its event-driven. SVG has a DOM, and will work with smil SMIL, so its far easier to do simple tasks like animation while being able to preserve state and extend functionality. --Cameron

=============================================================== From: Dan Lyke ------------------------------------------------------ On Tue, 19 Jul 2011 12:33:32 -0400 Cameron Kilgore wrote: It doesn't appear to be event driven for redraws. I think (and it's been a few weeks since I've played around with that code) that it was surprising to me because it really does allocate a bitmap. (Of course I also realized the other day that I still haven't made the conceptual switch to modern storage scales, as my podcaster transferred a fairly short 44mb audio file to my MP3 player and I realized that that was over twice the size of my first hard drive...) Dan

=============================================================== From: Cameron Kilgore ------------------------------------------------------ Well Canvas now has an event stack for interactivity, and it renders faster than SVG and WebGL. But for now, the kind of manipulation I'm doing is better suited for SVG/VML -Cameron Sent via an Android phone

=============================================================== From: "K. Elise Walker" ------------------------------------------------------ thanks guys. raphael looks awesome, but more suited for what I'm doing with my side projects than what my other job wants to do. they are looking to save our e-proofs of the products as svg (it is a drawing of the item ordered with a preview of the customer's vector art on it - completely vector file) to email to customers. right now we are using .pdfs, and they are just way too big and bulky so we were looking to update. They are going under the assumption that most people can view a pdf, but not most can view an svg.

=============================================================== From: Sean Brewer ------------------------------------------------------ Try the processing.js library. It's a re-implementation of the processing language in javascript for using canvas. It's great. Canvas is really old hat. Who's using WebGL? :-)