[Chugalug] More on Bitcoin:

Stephen Kraus ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com
Thu Aug 22 20:16:29 UTC 2013


"He's broadly right in that anything is worth the largest amount that
someone will pay for it, sorta. But that's tautological to the point of
being meaningless. During a market bubble shares in monkeyscrotum.com were
"worth" a thousand dollars each, because people were buying and selling
them for a thousand dollars, but at the same time they were worth nothing
at all because Monkeyscrotum.com was one guy at a rented desk with a stupid
idea that had no chance of actually becoming a viable business. It had
perceived value and thus trading value but no backing."

"The thing is, in all of those examples, there is *mutual demand*, i.e.,
you can only trade 10 pelts for 20 bushels if the bushels-owner needs
pelts. That's the reason money (USD) is useful—there is a near-infinite
demand for it. It's also why BTC is useless—absolutely nobody has any
demand for it outside from an insignificantly tiny fringe group.

Also, I like how those examples devolve in exactly the same way that
society would devolve if we all became libertarians. Today we want cars,
tomorrow we'll want guns, the next day we'll be offloading our worthless
gold for sheep, and by day 4 we're all hunter-gatherers desperate for food."

>From two of my economics friends. More coming.


On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 4:08 PM, Chad Smith <chad78 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Um, we are the 4th largest country in the world, physically (land mass),
> and 3rd in population.
>
> Hardly qualifies as "small" by any definition.
>
> *- Chad W. Smith*
>
>
> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 3:04 PM, Lynn Dixon <boodaddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Chad, indeed it is:
>>
>> US population: 300 Million
>> China Population: 1.344 billion
>> World Population: 7 billion
>> We only contain about 4% of the worlds population.  We are incredibly
>> tiny.
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 3:59 PM, Chad Smith <chad78 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Our country is not small.
>>>
>>> Carry on.
>>>
>>> *- Chad W. Smith*
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:52 PM, Lynn Dixon <boodaddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Again Stephen you are thinking on an extraordinary small plane.  I
>>>> certainly can take gold to many parts of the world (including in the US)
>>>> and buy products with it. Once you think outside our small country, the
>>>> world does things in many different ways.
>>>> The worth of anything is established by the parties in the transaction.
>>>>  For example:
>>>> 1. Is my wifes BMW worth trading even for a newer model accord?  Will
>>>> the seller agree to an even trade?
>>>> 2. Is my antique rifle worth trading to my neighbor for 2 of his
>>>> pistols?
>>>> 3. Is my 1 ounce of gold worth buying 100 sheep for my farm?
>>>> 4. Is the 10 pelts I hunted worth trading for 20 bushels of corn from
>>>> the farmer whom is needing pelts to clothe his family?
>>>>
>>>> Notice there was never any need for the USD in those examples?  So, the
>>>> value of anything is determinded by is scarcity and demand.  If I have good
>>>> you want, and you have goods I want, the value is the equlibirum at which
>>>> we are both happy with the trade.  If it was just you and I, that value
>>>> maybe 1:1.
>>>>
>>>> For example: You have 100 bushels of corn.  I have 100 pelts.  I need
>>>> corn for my family and you need pelts for the winter.  We could do a 1:1
>>>> trade, and both have 50 pelts and 50 bushels, and be happy.  Now, here
>>>> comes Randy. He has pelts to trade as well, and offers you 2 pelts for 1
>>>> bushel.  The value of your corn has just increased to 2 pelts because Randy
>>>> lives further north where there is less food. I have to pay you at least 2
>>>> pelts to get you to even consider.  Thus the value is controlled by the
>>>> supply and demand (scarcity of supply).
>>>>
>>>> The same applies to Bitcoins, and it does with USD, or EUR, or Yen or
>>>> pelts, or corn, or anything.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 3:34 PM, Stephen Kraus <ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I KNOW it has nothing to do with gold. I've said this three times in
>>>>> this exchange.
>>>>>
>>>>> Randy pointed out that the price of one bitcoin was $102 or 15 ounces
>>>>> of gold. I pointed out he was correct, while being sarcastic. I was being
>>>>> sarcastic for a reason because Randy basically pointed out exactly what I
>>>>> meant: Without the USD or Gold (In its USD equivalent i.e. the amount of
>>>>> gold you can buy with amount of USD) you are basically establishing worth.
>>>>> Its the only way to establish the worth of a Bitcoin.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nobody is going to take gold and give you a product, you still must
>>>>> trade in cash.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lynn, even those at the top of a pyramid scheme swear their system
>>>>> works.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 3:27 PM, Lynn Dixon <boodaddy at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Stephen,
>>>>>> I sincerely hope you do not think the CPI backs the US Dollar.  The
>>>>>> CPI is a lagging indicator of the rate of inflation. It is a measure of the
>>>>>> change in price of a set basket of goods. It has nothing to do with the
>>>>>> value of the USD, moreover it simply echoes the current value of the USD in
>>>>>> relation to this set basket of goods.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Here, educate yourself: http://www.bls.gov/cpi/cpifaq.htm
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The value of the dollar is quite simply controlled by monetary policy
>>>>>> of the Federal Reserve, which is ran by small group of men.  If I remember
>>>>>> my econmics lessons from college correctly, there are three things that
>>>>>> determinse the value of the dollar.  Our National debt has a huge impact on
>>>>>> the demand for this currency and conversely its value.
>>>>>> 1. Treasury Notes -- The tresuray controls the supply of these notes
>>>>>> and investors will auction for them. Sometimes for more than face value
>>>>>> (demand is high) sometimes for lower than face (Demand is low). Those
>>>>>> investors then re-sell those notes in a secondary market
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 2. Foreign Reserves --  When other countries import and export, they
>>>>>> sometimes end up with an excess or shortage of USD which also affects the
>>>>>> demand for it.  When the value starts to decline, these foreign countries
>>>>>> will dump their reserves (because who wants to hold worthless notes?). ANd
>>>>>> just like any market, this causes people to buy and sell.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 3. Exchange rates with other currrencies (since not everyone wants
>>>>>> the USD).  How the USD measures up to the value of other currencies.  Alot
>>>>>> of times, the GDP of the countries are analyzed and sometimes the
>>>>>> government stability is taken into consideration to detemine the actual
>>>>>> value of one currency to another.  The coutnries central bank interest
>>>>>> rates, debt levels (to both domestic and foreign bodies) GDP, and other
>>>>>> factors are what set the value.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A retailer or supplier would set the value of his products based upon
>>>>>> the demand for his products and the costs to make those products (time
>>>>>> value of money also included). I would also quip that I did indeed buy a
>>>>>> portion my servers, rackspace and hardware to mine my BTC with BTC.
>>>>>> However, I will admit, that when I pay my power I have to use my BTC to buy
>>>>>> US dollars since my electic company only accepts USD. I can't even use
>>>>>> Chad's paypal example, since they refuse to accept Paypal or even AMEX.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To Randy's point, and to argue against yours, I have no idea why you
>>>>>> had to assume One would take BTC, convert to USD, and then buy gold.  That
>>>>>> is plain stupid.  1 BTC is worth about .08 ounces of gold, and there are
>>>>>> vendors online that will trade their gold for your BTC. You dont have to go
>>>>>> through the crazy process of converting to USD, unless you simply like
>>>>>> converting currency for the hell of it. I really wish you would realize
>>>>>> there is more to this world than the USD.  Also to Randy's point, the
>>>>>> Dollar hasn't been backed by gold for a long time now.  See my points above
>>>>>> to learn how the value of the dollar is truly set (spoiler alert: It has
>>>>>> absolutely zero to do with gold anymore).
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:47 PM, Stephen Kraus <
>>>>>> ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Nothing backs the dollar, except the consumer price index.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But nothing backs bitcoins either.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Guess what Lynn? Ask the retailer you purchase from what the end
>>>>>>> pont of their bitcoins you give them are? Also, ask them how they set their
>>>>>>> values for bitcoin purchases are set?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm assuming the company didnt buy their servers, rackspace, in are
>>>>>>> paying their power bill in bitcoins
>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 2:36 PM, "Lynn Dixon" <boodaddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Stephen,
>>>>>>>> I have already told you what my bitcoins are worth.  I have bought
>>>>>>>> and sold several prodcuts and services using my Bitcoin, and none of them
>>>>>>>> invovled the USD.  Just recently  I bought 100G of Copy.com storage for .15
>>>>>>>> BTC.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am also thinking about buying a BlockEruptor for around 1 BTC,
>>>>>>>> just for poops and snickers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tell me, what "backs" the US Dollar?   I would imagine the essence
>>>>>>>> of your reply will be the same things that "backs" my BTC....the utility of
>>>>>>>> it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:31 PM, Stephen Kraus <
>>>>>>>> ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> No, Lynn I think its safe to say youbare severely overthinking
>>>>>>>>> bitcoins.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Tell me right now: outside of the processing cycles, invested
>>>>>>>>> piwer bill, and an algorithm, what backs your bitcoin?
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> What is one bitcoin worth? A gpu cycle? A power bill? Gold?
>>>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 2:28 PM, "Lynn Dixon" <boodaddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Stephen,
>>>>>>>>>> again, I think you and Chad fail to understand how Bitcoins
>>>>>>>>>> actually work.  The value (like anything in trade) is set by the parties
>>>>>>>>>> involved in the transactions.  If you ONLY think in USD then you are only
>>>>>>>>>> thinking very simple.  This is a global economy, I do business in more than
>>>>>>>>>> just the US.  The value of ANY currency is set by supply/demand.  With USD
>>>>>>>>>> the supply is artificially manipulated by the Fed, which in my opinion is
>>>>>>>>>> absolutely horrid. The Supply of Bitcoin is controlled by the peer-to-peer
>>>>>>>>>> network.  No one individual or entity can change the supply, therefore the
>>>>>>>>>> value backing the currency is the sheer demand for it.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I honestly have no idea how to continue this debate if we only
>>>>>>>>>> focus on the simple minded-ness of assuming everything is done in US
>>>>>>>>>> Dollars only.  The world doesnt revolve around the dollar.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:22 PM, Stephen Kraus <
>>>>>>>>>> ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> That is without even mentioning the cognitive dissonace of
>>>>>>>>>>> saying this:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> 'The dollar has no value because there is nothing backing it
>>>>>>>>>>> beyond the word of the government. So trade in bitcoins....which also have
>>>>>>>>>>> nothing backing it beyond our personal guarentees'
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Its the same thing. Meet the new boss, a clone of theold boss
>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 2:18 PM, "Stephen Kraus" <ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Good thing everyone has mining equipment. Oh wait, investment
>>>>>>>>>>>> costs!
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> As for buying them....do I even have to explain the cognitive
>>>>>>>>>>>> dissonance?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> 'The dollar is worthless we should replace it....but you can
>>>>>>>>>>>> freely purchase bitcoins with it, thereby implying that the dollar we say
>>>>>>>>>>>> has no value HAS value, because we are willing to accept it in trade'
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 2:15 PM, "Lynn Dixon" <boodaddy at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stephen,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Did you even read the article?  No where did it mention
>>>>>>>>>>>>> anything about USD or exchange rates.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are only two ways to get BTC.  1. Mine them 2. Buy them.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since most folks dont want to mine, they will buy BTC.  The
>>>>>>>>>>>>> website just listed the most recent exchange rate.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Heres another site for exchange rates:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.bitcoinwatch.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>  On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:09 PM, Stephen Kraus <
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Randy.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On the top of the very site you just linked to. Guess what
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those exchange rates establish? And the only reason payment processors
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> might be interested in bitcoins.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 2:06 PM, "Randy Yates" <lpcustom at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.coindesk.com/bitcoin-debit-card-ibtcard-will-offer-lower-processing-fees-for-merchants/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's coming :)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:03 PM, Chad Smith <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chad78 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *sigh* no one ever pays me in Gum!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *- Chad W. Smith*
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 1:01 PM, Chad Smith <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chad78 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You could buy lunch with Pesos if you're Pesos were in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bank and you had a debit card that automatically converted for you (like I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> paid for software in Euros yesterday through PayPal without ever owning a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Euro in my life).  The same cannot be said for BitCoins - or POGs - or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Beanie Babies - or Baseball cards - or Star Wars action figures - or Yugioh
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cards - or Pokemon - or Level 80 WoW characters...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> All of those things have some value to some people - and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they will gladly trade with you for them - but they are not actual
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> currency.  You can't take your comic book collection to the bank and ask
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> them to give you the equivalence in Pounds Sterling.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *- Chad W. Smith*
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Lynn Dixon <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> boodaddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chris,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is an excellent point! Peso are a "world recognized
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> currency", but yet, I can't buy my lunch with Pesos.  Well I probably could
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> here in Dalton (local yocals will get that joke), but in Benton, probably
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 1:37 PM, Chris Mowery <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cmowery at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you take pesos to a gas station, do they take those?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thursday, August 22, 2013, Stephen Kraus wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lynn.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Doesn't matter. Its still a fiat currency and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> non-negotiable at any major retailer that cannot convert it to cash.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Its like you went to the arcade and cashed in for some
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tokens and expect everyone to accept them because of the value the arcade
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> places on the token
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 1:32 PM, "Stephen Kraus" <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Go to a gas station. Right now. Pay for gas and a soda
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with bitcoins.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Don't take out your credit card. Don't use cash. Use
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bitcoins.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Why can't you? Because they don't understand its value?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could say I have sea shells. I believe they have some
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> value to me, but people don't understand their value, so I can't use them
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to pay for products immediately. But maybe I can trade someone else who
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> values sea shells in trade for cash. Suddenly my sea shells have worth,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> despite the apparent lack of actual value as a wide currency.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> But that does not mean I can magically declare the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> major currency accepted globally as dead becauwe my sea shells hava
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> negotiable value among a select group
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 1:26 PM, "Tyler Mittan" <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> flashbatmanquestion at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Randy and Lynn are right on.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The more important part of this is that we ought to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have competing currencies to keep whomever the issuers are honest. No one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wants bad money. This criticism of no one taking Bitcoins is totally off
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> base. First, not everyone knows about bitcoins or how it works. Secondly,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the dollar is propped up for two reasons.. People have to use dollars
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because that's what the government forces banks to accept and because
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people think the government's handling of the money supply us trustworthy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because most people don't understand the political motive to devalue
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> currency
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 1:19 PM, "Stephen Kraus" <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lynn, while you may MAKE money off bitcoins, the value
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of the traded bitcoins and the inherint value you get from them is.....in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dollars.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> While some (very few) retailers may accept bitcoin,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> even their expectation is to either gain more bitcoins which they can then
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> launder into dollars or exchange them as well for another service, but even
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> THAT service expects the value of the bitcoins they pay to transfer to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dollars somehow.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Until you can go to a local grocer or gas station and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> directly pay with bitcoins, its going to remain a neat, yet niche idea.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 1:15 PM, "Lynn Dixon" <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> boodaddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chad,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I disagree.  Bitcoins are just like anything, the value
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of it is determined by the demand/supply for it.  The supply is very fixed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> by the network, and cannot be manipulated.  Therefore the value is directly
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> linked to the demand of the currency.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The exception with Bitcoin is that people are actually
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> using as a medium of exchange for goods, services, and even currency
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> exchange.  I use it for all 3 of these.  I don't think people used POGs as
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a medium of exchange.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 12:52 PM, Chad Smith <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chad78 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's like POGs.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Remember POGs?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> BitCoins are like POGs.  Really, in and of themselves,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that have absolutely no value.  But, for a while in the 90s, some people
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> got RICH off of POGs.  Why?  Because they were able to convince people they
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> needed to have them.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> People bought into it - and some of *those *people
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> also got rich - because they collected and traded and sold them.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Eventually, it all came crashing down, because it is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> very hard to keep convincing people they need to spend actually real-world
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> money on little cardboard discs.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> BitCoin is POGs for the Twenty-Teens Tech Geek.  It
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> won't last.  But there will be people who make
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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