[Chugalug] More on Bitcoin:

Lynn Dixon boodaddy at gmail.com
Thu Aug 22 18:29:29 UTC 2013


Stephen
Maybe you should try selling on better sites then. hehe (sorry had to jab).
 Heres one that lets you use a flexible currency:  https://www.bitmit.net/


On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:27 PM, Stephen Kraus <ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com>wrote:

> Its funny that, Aaron a good comparison.
>
> Because if I sell something on Ebay, I set a price in USD.
>
> And if paypal doesn't give my bank my USD, I get cross
> On Aug 22, 2013 2:25 PM, "Aaron welch" <n2nightfall at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Also keep in mind that for all intents and purposes of Stephen's
>> argument, Paypal is also a new form of currency as it can be converted to
>> any other currency by the system.  The money in your Paypal account is just
>> 1's and 0's and not like the money in your bank account.  It is represented
>> in value by my local currency, but can be shown in any number of values for
>> other currencies.
>>
>> -AW
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:07 PM, Lynn Dixon <boodaddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Chad,
>>> I am not sure how this relates?  You bought a product using an exchange
>>> service.  You exchanged your USD for EUR.  I can do that all day long with
>>> my BTC.
>>>
>>> www.mtgox.com
>>>
>>> www.coinbase.com
>>>
>>> www.campbx.com
>>>
>>> Those are just a few.  There are even Bitcoin ATM's being produced.
>>>  What would you have done if that vendor did not accept Paypal?  You would
>>> have had to go and buy EUR somewhere else.
>>>
>>> Whe  I buy using BTC, I don';t have to have an antique debit card.  I
>>> can use my phone, scan a barcode, use NFC, or enter their address.  This
>>> argument seems invalid as you are trying to discredit bitcoin because you
>>> cant swipe an old debit card?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 2:01 PM, Chad Smith <chad78 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> You could buy lunch with Pesos if you're Pesos were in the bank and you
>>>> had a debit card that automatically converted for you (like I paid for
>>>> software in Euros yesterday through PayPal without ever owning a Euro in my
>>>> life).  The same cannot be said for BitCoins - or POGs - or Beanie Babies -
>>>> or Baseball cards - or Star Wars action figures - or Yugioh cards - or
>>>> Pokemon - or Level 80 WoW characters...
>>>>
>>>> All of those things have some value to some people - and they will
>>>> gladly trade with you for them - but they are not actual currency.  You
>>>> can't take your comic book collection to the bank and ask them to give you
>>>> the equivalence in Pounds Sterling.
>>>>
>>>> *- Chad W. Smith*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 12:55 PM, Lynn Dixon <boodaddy at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Chris,
>>>>> This is an excellent point! Peso are a "world recognized currency",
>>>>> but yet, I can't buy my lunch with Pesos.  Well I probably could here in
>>>>> Dalton (local yocals will get that joke), but in Benton, probably not.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 1:37 PM, Chris Mowery <cmowery at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> If you take pesos to a gas station, do they take those?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thursday, August 22, 2013, Stephen Kraus wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lynn.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Doesn't matter. Its still a fiat currency and non-negotiable at any
>>>>>>> major retailer that cannot convert it to cash.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Its like you went to the arcade and cashed in for some tokens and
>>>>>>> expect everyone to accept them because of the value the arcade places on
>>>>>>> the token
>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 1:32 PM, "Stephen Kraus" <ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Go to a gas station. Right now. Pay for gas and a soda with bitcoins.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Don't take out your credit card. Don't use cash. Use bitcoins.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Why can't you? Because they don't understand its value?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I could say I have sea shells. I believe they have some value to me,
>>>>>>> but people don't understand their value, so I can't use them to pay for
>>>>>>> products immediately. But maybe I can trade someone else who values sea
>>>>>>> shells in trade for cash. Suddenly my sea shells have worth, despite the
>>>>>>> apparent lack of actual value as a wide currency.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> But that does not mean I can magically declare the major currency
>>>>>>> accepted globally as dead becauwe my sea shells hava negotiable value among
>>>>>>> a select group
>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 1:26 PM, "Tyler Mittan" <
>>>>>>> flashbatmanquestion at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Randy and Lynn are right on.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The more important part of this is that we ought to have competing
>>>>>>> currencies to keep whomever the issuers are honest. No one wants bad money.
>>>>>>> This criticism of no one taking Bitcoins is totally off base. First, not
>>>>>>> everyone knows about bitcoins or how it works. Secondly, the dollar is
>>>>>>> propped up for two reasons.. People have to use dollars because that's what
>>>>>>> the government forces banks to accept and because people think the
>>>>>>> government's handling of the money supply us trustworthy because most
>>>>>>> people don't understand the political motive to devalue currency
>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 1:19 PM, "Stephen Kraus" <ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lynn, while you may MAKE money off bitcoins, the value of the traded
>>>>>>> bitcoins and the inherint value you get from them is.....in dollars.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> While some (very few) retailers may accept bitcoin, even their
>>>>>>> expectation is to either gain more bitcoins which they can then launder
>>>>>>> into dollars or exchange them as well for another service, but even THAT
>>>>>>> service expects the value of the bitcoins they pay to transfer to dollars
>>>>>>> somehow.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Until you can go to a local grocer or gas station and directly pay
>>>>>>> with bitcoins, its going to remain a neat, yet niche idea.
>>>>>>> On Aug 22, 2013 1:15 PM, "Lynn Dixon" <boodaddy at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chad,
>>>>>>> I disagree.  Bitcoins are just like anything, the value of it is
>>>>>>> determined by the demand/supply for it.  The supply is very fixed by the
>>>>>>> network, and cannot be manipulated.  Therefore the value is directly linked
>>>>>>> to the demand of the currency.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The exception with Bitcoin is that people are actually using as a
>>>>>>> medium of exchange for goods, services, and even currency exchange.  I use
>>>>>>> it for all 3 of these.  I don't think people used POGs as a medium of
>>>>>>> exchange.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Aug 22, 2013 at 12:52 PM, Chad Smith <chad78 at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's like POGs.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Remember POGs?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> BitCoins are like POGs.  Really, in and of themselves, that have
>>>>>>> absolutely no value.  But, for a while in the 90s, some people got RICH off
>>>>>>> of POGs.  Why?  Because they were able to convince people they needed to
>>>>>>> have them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> People bought into it - and some of *those *people also got rich -
>>>>>>> because they collected and traded and sold them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Eventually, it all came crashing down, because it is very hard to
>>>>>>> keep convincing people they need to spend actually real-world money on
>>>>>>> little cardboard discs.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> BitCoin is POGs for the Twenty-Teens Tech Geek.  It won't last.  But
>>>>>>> there will be people who make
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>
>> --
>> Aaron Welch
>> Chief Mechanic @ Geek Ventures
>> 423-505-9999
>> n2nightfall at gmail.com
>> "Enabling people to do great things with their own ideas."
>>
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