[Chugalug] Bitcoin = scam

Stephen Kraus ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com
Wed Aug 7 13:14:31 UTC 2013


Aaron, the US dollar holds buying power because banks, companies, and the
US government says it does. Thats a lot of weight, not to mention, no
matter how bad it gets foreign traders still recognize the USD as having
buying power.
On Aug 7, 2013 8:12 AM, "Stephen Kraus" <ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Lets put the whole 'limited amount' im perspective:
>
> Lets say you are a panhandler, you find a cache of gold.
>
> Awesome! So you mine as fast as you can, but eventually a large and fairly
> well to do company finds out.
>
> You can mine as fast as you can, but that large company has equipment,
> manpower, and time on their side.
> On Aug 7, 2013 7:57 AM, "Aaron Welch" <n2nightfall at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I would love to have a discussion about this at a CHUGALUG event sometime.
>>
>> -AW
>>
>> On Aug 7, 2013, at 8:50 AM, Randy Yates <lpcustom at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Except that there is a limited number of bitcoins, and the limit on
>> dollars keeps going up.
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Aug 7, 2013 at 8:32 AM, Stephen Kraus <ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Also, I'd point out that you are effectively doing with Bitcoins what
>>> many Libertarians claim the US Federal Reserve is doing: pulling money out
>>> of thin air.
>>>  On Aug 7, 2013 7:21 AM, "Stephen Kraus" <ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Its not anger. Its confusion.
>>>>
>>>> Also, its a fiat currency.
>>>> On Aug 7, 2013 6:01 AM, "James Nylen" <jnylen at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Randy, I agree... I think much of the negativity towards Bitcoin is
>>>>> unwarranted.  I understand unwillingness to spend money on something that
>>>>> has less real value than a tulip, but that shouldn't translate into anger
>>>>> when it turns out to actually have made some people a lot of money.
>>>>>
>>>>> Source:  http://buttcoin.org/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Aug 6, 2013 at 10:35 PM, Randy Yates <lpcustom at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> You guys were saying the same thing when it was $9 per bitcoin. If
>>>>>> you'd taken a $100 risk, you could have brought in around $2400 last month.
>>>>>> I'm not saying that I'd start using bitcoin as my currency of choice at the
>>>>>> moment. I'm just saying that there have been plenty of negativity toward it
>>>>>> on here and I only wish I'd swept some of that aside and bought about 100
>>>>>> bitcoins last year when it was low. I could have paid a chunk of my house
>>>>>> off this year.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 6, 2013 at 9:50 PM, James Nylen <jnylen at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Stephen,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think Bitcoin shows some truly interesting qualities.  It is hard
>>>>>>> to counterfeit, transparent, and easy to spend.  Digital currencies based
>>>>>>> on cryptography show great promise in terms of libertarian free-market
>>>>>>> ideals.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I must disclose that I made a small investment in Bitcoin a couple
>>>>>>> years ago, so my conclusions are subject to the usual biases.  Thus far,
>>>>>>> though, I'm glad to have been part of the experiment.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Aug 6, 2013 at 1:37 PM, Stephen Kraus <
>>>>>>> ub3ratl4sf00 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I've tried explaining this before, but unfortunately people are
>>>>>>>> really bought into the idea, and its none of my business what they do with
>>>>>>>> their time and processing power.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Its pretty much a pyramid scam, insufficient as a dependable
>>>>>>>> currency and fluctuates too quickly.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Buy, people can do as they please, but its along the same lines as
>>>>>>>> claiming vaccines cause autism.
>>>>>>>> On Aug 6, 2013 12:01 PM, "Mike Robinson" <miker at sundialservices.com>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'll call it what it -is-:  it's a scam directed at nerds.  "...
>>>>>>>>> and two to take him."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The con consists, first, of posing a computationally-difficult yet
>>>>>>>>> not-insurmountable crypto problem.  It can be solved; it just takes a long
>>>>>>>>> time.  So, nerds are instantly absorbed in the "challenge for a challenge's
>>>>>>>>> own sake," namely, to solve the problem.  They can be counted on not to
>>>>>>>>> examine the whole proposal too-seriously, because nerds generally consider
>>>>>>>>> themselves to be trustworthy and thus are too-trusting.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> "Someone (but we don't actually know who ...) said" that the
>>>>>>>>> number of bitcoins would be limited .. which is a necessary premise if
>>>>>>>>> you're being conned into thinking that you're mining for gold.  "Tokens can
>>>>>>>>> only be used once."  And most importantly, "the verification software
>>>>>>>>> cannot be tricked into giving a false-positive."
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Subtly, now, the nerds are suckered into giving-up REAL CURRENCY
>>>>>>>>> ... more than $100 USD at this point ... which they don't mind doing
>>>>>>>>> because, of course, they're sure that Nothing Comes Down (-and- that there
>>>>>>>>> is something holding it Up in the first place).
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It's pointless, though, to argue these points with people who have
>>>>>>>>> caught "digital Gold Fever."  The only thing that can be done in that case
>>>>>>>>> is to sell them shovels and picks, which is precisely what Leland Stanford,
>>>>>>>>> among many others, did.  Well, I have nothing to sell you, but I'll rest my
>>>>>>>>> case at this point and disregard the inevitable rebuttal.  Presumably,
>>>>>>>>> you're not going to lose any money that you can't afford to lose.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Aug 5, 2013, at 5:50 PM, chugalug-request at chugalug.org wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Call it what you will, but those who got into Bitcoin early have
>>>>>>>>> done
>>>>>>>>> extremely well.  Also, there is a pretty clear exponential trend
>>>>>>>>> relative
>>>>>>>>> to the dollar, which implies its value is still increasing.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> Chugalug mailing list
>>>>>>>>> Chugalug at chugalug.org
>>>>>>>>> http://chugalug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/chugalug
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Chugalug mailing list
>>>>>>>> Chugalug at chugalug.org
>>>>>>>> http://chugalug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/chugalug
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Chugalug mailing list
>>>>>>> Chugalug at chugalug.org
>>>>>>> http://chugalug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/chugalug
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Google reads my email!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> Chugalug mailing list
>>>>>> Chugalug at chugalug.org
>>>>>> http://chugalug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/chugalug
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Chugalug mailing list
>>>>> Chugalug at chugalug.org
>>>>> http://chugalug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/chugalug
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Chugalug mailing list
>>> Chugalug at chugalug.org
>>> http://chugalug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/chugalug
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Google reads my email!
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chugalug mailing list
>> Chugalug at chugalug.org
>> http://chugalug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/chugalug
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Chugalug mailing list
>> Chugalug at chugalug.org
>> http://chugalug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/chugalug
>>
>>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://chugalug.org/pipermail/chugalug/attachments/20130807/f5263d30/attachment-0001.html>


More information about the Chugalug mailing list